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Greg E
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« on: September 07, 2021, 02:18:38 PM » |
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Hi,
I am trying to identify a video of Fairport that I has been sent to me. I am no expert so I need help. I will at some point share it if it turns out to be interesting, but I don't know if it is yet. It is 'almost' definitely 1985. But I think it might be cropedy, even though it is listed as Vienna Folk Festival. Is '85 cropedy available on video? has anyone got any images of it? That should be all I need. I tried Google of course but couldn't see a 1985 image of the band on stage (this will be the Sunday night set) nor any reference to a video.
cheers
right, I think I have added an image...
yes, that is Richard Thompson and Jerry Donahue
another edit.
I think it must be Vienna (or at least not cropedy) as I have checked the setlist. On this one they play Wall of Death. SO, has anyone come across it before? It is good quality and about 85 minutes but finished with Matty Groves so doesn't show encore
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« Last Edit: September 07, 2021, 02:48:02 PM by Greg E »
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davidmjs
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« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2021, 03:00:47 PM » |
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Hi,
I am trying to identify a video of Fairport that I has been sent to me. I am no expert so I need help. I will at some point share it if it turns out to be interesting, but I don't know if it is yet. It is 'almost' definitely 1985. But I think it might be cropedy, even though it is listed as Vienna Folk Festival. Is '85 cropedy available on video? has anyone got any images of it? That should be all I need. I tried Google of course but couldn't see a 1985 image of the band on stage (this will be the Sunday night set) nor any reference to a video.
cheers
right, I think I have added an image...
yes, that is Richard Thompson and Jerry Donahue
another edit.
I think it must be Vienna (or at least not cropedy) as I have checked the setlist. On this one they play Wall of Death. SO, has anyone come across it before? It is good quality and about 85 minutes but finished with Matty Groves so doesn't show encore
All I can say is a) '85 looks about right (but I missed that Cropredy) b) anything where RT and Jerry are together onstage is fab and c) can I see it please?   Are there any other guests? I think Trevor was at Cropredy in '85. If not it definitely sounds like something else. If it's Vienna (Nov?) it must be indoors... |
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Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.
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Jamie
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« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2021, 03:30:28 PM » |
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'85 was the strange year when they had a new album out but didn't play any of it at Cropredy. I was there and remember that it was fab, with Fairport on both nights (Full House line-up on the Friday) but the details have all but gone, along with my hair and my knees.
It doesn't look like the Cropredy stage of the time and according to the FC List they didn't do Wall of Death. To confuse matters Simon is wearing the same jumper as at Cropredy '82 (which I have, by coincidence, just been copying from VHS to DVD) but Richard wasn't at that one (though Linda very much was).
Maybe yours is what it says on the tin, though I'd be intrigued as to how they got Richard and Jerry out to Vienna for it - in any case, it looks like a real find and I would love to see it!
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Greg E
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« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2021, 04:10:57 PM » |
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Cool, thanks both. I think then we can be pretty certain then of it being in Vienna, it fits in with were it came to me from as well.
I will message you both with more details, and anyone else in due course. If you could keep it close to your chests for a while that would be much appreciated until I can get more detail on it's provenance, I don't want to tread on anyone's toes as these things can have a commercial value.
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RobertD
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« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2021, 09:15:14 PM » |
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Cool, thanks both. I think then we can be pretty certain then of it being in Vienna, it fits in with were it came to me from as well.
I will message you both with more details, and anyone else in due course. If you could keep it close to your chests for a while that would be much appreciated until I can get more detail on it's provenance, I don't want to tread on anyone's toes as these things can have a commercial value.
I like a bit of a mystery, so here are a few things I found, courtesy of concertswiki. By no means completely accurate, it still has an awful lot of info, especially for Richard. Using Simon’s jumper being confirmed 1982 vintage, I found a May 19, 1982 date in Rotterdam, with the next date listed being 8 days later in Nottingham. No other European dates but unlikely that was his only European show of the tour. In 1986, I see 3 confirmed European dates, but they looked to be acoustic shows- November 6th and 23rd in Sweden, November 24th in Oslo. Obviously a big gap there For both periods there was a lot of cross pollination with Simon, DM and Peggy. Jerry is the mystery. Too soon for the Hellecasters, and pretty sure he had left the UK by that point. Just adding to the mystery! |
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I'm just a little shy of Surf's Up and I'm deeper than Twist and Shout....Iain Matthews
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davidmjs
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« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2021, 09:28:23 PM » |
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Cool, thanks both. I think then we can be pretty certain then of it being in Vienna, it fits in with were it came to me from as well.
I will message you both with more details, and anyone else in due course. If you could keep it close to your chests for a while that would be much appreciated until I can get more detail on it's provenance, I don't want to tread on anyone's toes as these things can have a commercial value.
I like a bit of a mystery, so here are a few things I found, courtesy of concertswiki. By no means completely accurate, it still has an awful lot of info, especially for Richard. Using Simon’s jumper being confirmed 1982 vintage, I found a May 19, 1982 date in Rotterdam, with the next date listed being 8 days later in Nottingham. No other European dates but unlikely that was his only European show of the tour. In 1986, I see 3 confirmed European dates, but they looked to be acoustic shows- November 6th and 23rd in Sweden, November 24th in Oslo. Obviously a big gap there For both periods there was a lot of cross pollination with Simon, DM and Peggy. Jerry is the mystery. Too soon for the Hellecasters, and pretty sure he had left the UK by that point. Just adding to the mystery! It's obviously not '86 as Swarb and Bruce are there. From the look of them all, I see no reason to doubt it being the final fling of the old lineup in '85 before the Spring tour with the new boys the next year. I saw the four earlier that year and they look spot on for that to me. On the footage I've so far seen, Jerry get's introduced as flying in from LA...I'm only half way through...will look at the rest tomorrow. It's bloody good. |
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Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.
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RobertD
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« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2021, 09:38:56 PM » |
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Yes meant to say 1985, clearly not 86 as you say
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I'm just a little shy of Surf's Up and I'm deeper than Twist and Shout....Iain Matthews
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davidmjs
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« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2021, 09:14:38 AM » |
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Incidentally, when were the first dates with the new Maart/Ric lineup (and last with Bruce/Swarb)? I always thought it was the Spring '86 tour...but was it actually after the Australian tour? Or the June Festival Hall date? Or Cropredy? https://keithparry.org/music/fairport-convention/ |
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Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.
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Phil Perry
sufficiently persuaded
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Posts: 202
Loc: Hertfordshire
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« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2021, 11:27:17 AM » |
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Fortunately, the only issue of "The Ledge" that I have kept was what I regarded as a "historical" one, being the issue that covered the new line-up. Through this I can say that the first appearance of the "Maart" line-up was at The Sir George Robey pub, Finsbury Park, on 28 October 1985. I did not go, but some friends did and came away unsure if this was really a whole new line-up or a temporary measure. However, The Ledge shows the gig as being just the first date of "Gladys' World Leap '85 and '86" (although Germany is the only country covered outside of the UK !!) which finished on 18/1/1986. I attended the Greenwich gig on 30 November and remember being a bit worried about taking my now-wife to see FC for the first time. In the event, I need not have worried, it being a lot easier for her to digest the likes of The Hiring Fair than the likes of Sloth ! I am reasonably certain that the last appearance by Swarb in a "current line-up" was Cropredy 1985.
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davidmjs
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« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2021, 11:34:30 AM » |
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Fortunately, the only issue of "The Ledge" that I have kept was what I regarded as a "historical" one, being the issue that covered the new line-up. Through this I can say that the first appearance of the "Maart" line-up was at The Sir George Robey pub, Finsbury Park, on 28 October 1985. I did not go, but some friends did and came away unsure if this was really a whole new line-up or a temporary measure. However, The Ledge shows the gig as being just the first date of "Gladys' World Leap '85 and '86" (although Germany is the only country covered outside of the UK !!) which finished on 18/1/1986. I attended the Greenwich gig on 30 November and remember being a bit worried about taking my now-wife to see FC for the first time. In the event, I need not have worried, it being a lot easier for her to digest the likes of The Hiring Fair than the likes of Sloth ! I am reasonably certain that the last appearance by Swarb in a "current line-up" was Cropredy 1985.
Thanks, Phil. Which means then that the date for the Vienna Folk Festival gig above (much repeated online as "? Nov 85") is definitely incorrect. Maybe time to ask a reliable source.... |
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Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.
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RobertD
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« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2021, 11:50:54 AM » |
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Incidentally, when were the first dates with the new Maart/Ric lineup (and last with Bruce/Swarb)? I always thought it was the Spring '86 tour...but was it actually after the Australian tour? Or the June Festival Hall date? Or Cropredy? https://keithparry.org/music/fairport-convention/Fairport UnConventional has that as November 22, 1985, billed as The New Music From Old Friends Tour. Maart had only been asked to join the day after Live Aid as legend has it |
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I'm just a little shy of Surf's Up and I'm deeper than Twist and Shout....Iain Matthews
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Greg E
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« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2021, 12:35:11 PM » |
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It seems most likely then that the Vienna Folk Festival took place either shortly before Cropedy (and used a warm up with Richard and Jerry) or shortly after as a result of the two of them being at Cropedy ('hey guys that was fun, do you want to come over to Austria, they have deep pockets and are willing to pay'.. ) |
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davidmjs
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« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2021, 12:37:47 PM » |
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Incidentally, when were the first dates with the new Maart/Ric lineup (and last with Bruce/Swarb)? I always thought it was the Spring '86 tour...but was it actually after the Australian tour? Or the June Festival Hall date? Or Cropredy? https://keithparry.org/music/fairport-convention/Fairport UnConventional has that as November 22, 1985, billed as The New Music From Old Friends Tour. Maart had only been asked to join the day after Live Aid as legend has it There's a balls up somewhere...as that date is given in the Keith Parry list as Vebeer Manor, Cullompton. It is ludicrous to think that that they were happily playing with Swarb and Bruce AND Ric and Maart at the same time. I'm sure this Vienna date is earlier. The band relations look good on stage. Professionals I know, but even so. I do find it really odd that there is nothing about the Vienna Folk Festival 1985 online |
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Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.
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davidmjs
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« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2021, 12:39:45 PM » |
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It seems most likely then that the Vienna Folk Festival took place either shortly before Cropedy (and used a warm up with Richard and Jerry) or shortly after as a result of the two of them being at Cropedy ('hey guys that was fun, do you want to come over to Austria, they have deep pockets and are willing to pay'.. ) I agree. My money is on before....somewhere between the US dates with Steeleye (2 and 7 June) and 9 Aug. |
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Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right.
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Greg E
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« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2021, 12:45:25 PM » |
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It seems most likely then that the Vienna Folk Festival took place either shortly before Cropedy (and used a warm up with Richard and Jerry) or shortly after as a result of the two of them being at Cropedy ('hey guys that was fun, do you want to come over to Austria, they have deep pockets and are willing to pay'.. ) I agree. My money is on before....somewhere between the US dates with Steeleye (2 and 7 June) and 9 Aug. and for what its worth the 1980 and 1981 editions were both held on the third weekend in June. Festivals don't often change dates. |
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Jamie
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« Reply #15 on: September 10, 2021, 07:50:48 PM » |
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Here's a review of the Vienna Folk Festival From Folk Roots November '85. This would have been published in early October (maybe even late September) so the festival can't have been in November - I'd say August, just before or after Cropredy, would be a good bet.
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Jamie
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« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2021, 10:05:46 AM » |
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A bit more digging into my old Folk Roots mags (I knew my hoarding instincts would bear fruit one day!) gives the dates for Vienna '85 as 17th-18th August. So the weekend after Cropredy.
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Greg E
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« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2021, 11:31:52 AM » |
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Nice one, cheers.
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Phil Perry
sufficiently persuaded
Full Member
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Posts: 202
Loc: Hertfordshire
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« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2021, 05:38:20 PM » |
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That Vienna FF article was fascinating, but it does not quite solve the mystery of when the line-up changed, as the FC line-up is not specified. We surely have to assume, however, that it was the Swarb line-up, because surely the reviewer would have mentioned it if there had been a change. Which leaves us with the thought that for a month after 14 July (day after Live Aid) Simon & Peggy had been keeping the new line-up under their hats. Either that, or Swarb agreed to do Cropredy and Vienna despite knowing about it ...
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Greg E
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« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2021, 06:03:56 PM » |
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That Vienna FF article was fascinating, but it does not quite solve the mystery of when the line-up changed, as the FC line-up is not specified. We surely have to assume, however, that it was the Swarb line-up, because surely the reviewer would have mentioned it if there had been a change. Which leaves us with the thought that for a month after 14 July (day after Live Aid) Simon & Peggy had been keeping the new line-up under their hats. Either that, or Swarb agreed to do Cropredy and Vienna despite knowing about it ...
We know from the video that the FC line up was Swarb, Pegg, Nicol, Rowlands. (plus guests). With the next appearance not until 28th Oct and which is confirmed as the new line up, it means the video is the last appearance of Swarb in FC as a full time member? |
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