TalkAwhile - The Folk Corporation Forum

Slipped out today, in an email with Feast of Fiddles dates for the spring, is the news that they are playing on Thursday at Cropredy next year!

First confirmed act, I think?

One band does not a festival make (well, apart from Fairport, I suppose  ;D), but it's a good start.

Oh fabulous, so pleased!

Fairport website as of today is saying tickets on sale Monday 11th Dec with first acts announced then.
Nearly time to see if all your wishes have come true!

That's the day I get back to the UK. Whoopee!

We havent missed one for 35 years but next year is looking doubtful as we have to travel to France on the Following Monday for my youngest's wedding. Decent headliners (or otherwise) may swing it either way.

Just received the email with the line up so far. Can't say I'm excited about the headliners (Rick Wakeman and Trevor Horn - again!), but some good stuff elsewhere. Eddi Reader, Spooky Men, Baskery, Big Big Train, Kathryn Tickell, all solid bookings.

Here's the full list:

Baskery
Big Big Train
Black Water County
DeWolff
Eddi Reader
Elles Bailey
Fairport
Feast of Fiddles
Focus
Kathryn Tickell and The Darkening
Ranagri
Richard Digance
Rick Wakeman and the English Rock Ensemble
Silver Blues
Spooky Men's Chorale
Trevor Horn Band

A very easy decision . Thanks for that.

Good, solid, but not exciting, for me anyway. Might pop over for the Saturday, but no particular artist booked so far that would sway me to buy a 3 or 2 day ticket. 2023 was always going to be hard to beat, admittedly...

Another fallow year for devotees of Fairport guitar Gods?

DeWolff is an interesting choice. Sixties drenched hard rocking blues with hints of psych & soul. I think they'll either go down a storm or have people scurrying to the beer tent.

I'll be curious to hear how Big Big Train will go with Alberto Bravin in place of David Longdon. The latter was a force of nature on stage. I'm disappointed that Carly Bryant has stepped away from the band too. I enjoyed her song on Welcome To The Planet.

Others I've never seen live but would like to catch at some point, are Baskery & Black Water County. They're both excellent on record.

Baskery are even better live. It is kind of bonkers what they do.

I am no longer a Cropredy attendee (I did a warm up show this year) but there are several of my favourite festival acts in that line up. Eddi Reader is always sublime. I wonder how the Spooky Men will come across in such a big field. They are hugely entertaining in more intimate surroundings.

There's a few I haven't a clue about and a few I'm looking forward to. However, as much as I enjoyed the Trevor Horn Band, it seems a bit much to invite them back for a third festival in such a short space of time. Other than that, I'm fairly happy with the line up so far. Obviously, there will be a few more added later, so let's hope there are a couple of nice surprises..

I agree about Trevor Horne. It's getting a bit like their obsession with Marillion a few years back. Just too much.
On the plus side, Wakeman,  Focus and Tickell yaayy, and plenty of interesting unknowns. Praying for a good Thursday night lead now...

Saw Big Big Train earlier this year and I think they're as good as - if a little different - as before the sad passing of Dave Longdon.

Good lineup for me this year.  I can sort of see the Trevor Horn / Marillion comparison but Mr Horn has some back catalogue to draw on so there shouldn't be much repeating...

Wakeman is the Thursday night headliner.

There was quite a lot of repeating at their second appearance, I'd estimate at least two thirds of the set. So I'm in the like them but too soon camp.

Just noticed that Baskery are touring in March. Hopefully, I'll be able to get to their Skipton show.

I'm not keen on large one-stage festivals so Cropredy has never been on my list of must-do events but I always like checking out the line-up and reading people's reviews after the event.

Booked a warm up, first time in a long time, but decided to go this time.

Booked three days too!

Yippeeee!, 😁😁😁

How do you know this?

I went and panic booked glamping but I’m really not enticed by today’s list.

I’m guessing it’s just 1 headliner and 1 other to be announced?

It says so in the email, and on the Fairport website.

It also says that Trevor Horn Band is the Friday headliner.

CCd

It didn’t say anything about a sliding scale of costs this time, did it? Unless I missed it.

It says Tier one tickets, so...

Oh I missed that, skimming over it...ah well  ;D

Big Big Train... Yeah!  Been top of my wishlist for Cropredy for the last several years!  And Kathryn Tickell.  A good solid start, I reckon.  I'll definitely be there.

I don't know how many tier one tickets there were, but by 19.50 on Monday when I bought my tickets it was up to tier 2.

Looks like a good line up to me. I'm looking forward to seeing Focus again. I'm happy with the Thursday and Friday headline acts and SilverBlues should be really interesting - they've got a great back catalogue to choose from with Lindisfarne and Fairport songs and tunes to pick from.

I saw SilverBlues a couple of months ago… they were great!

Bought my ticket today.

I thought I'd be in time for tier one but that happened to me too.
SilverBlues were excellent at the New Forest Folk Festival last July. Good to see them in the line up.

Shouldn't the very wonderful Plumhall be on having done the tour.....

According to Steve Knightley's FB post this morning, he'll be playing at Cropredy Fringe with his new project, Dream In Colour, which also features Johnny Kalsi.  He didn't say which venue.

Both the tier 1 tickets were sold on the first day !!!    I really think that this Tier 1, tier 2 tickets is a sneaky way of putting the price up when they feel like it. Why not be honest about it, First xxxx tier 1, followed by xxxx at tier 2 at least we would have a bit of an idea how much a ticket costs. Like others, I thought I would get tier 1 buying in the first few days but I didn't, not particularly happy, I can afford it but I DO think its a sneaky way to price it.

Virtually every other festival in the land, and many other events of course, do this and with much less transparency.  By all means rail against the myriad ways capitalism get us to spend our money but don't single out one of the better proponents of the dark arts for doing something uniquely awful.  Basically, if you're quick enough you'll get the tier you want.  As you yourself admit, you didn't, so probably best to be "not particularly happy" with yourself rather than with the festival organisers...?

Does every other festival do this? Yes they have different pricing, with prices going up on certain dates, like Cropredy did until very recently and I have no problem with this, you know where you stand. With no ticket amounts or dates no one has a clue, there obvious were not many Tier 1 tickets judging by what people have said on here, if there are just 500 Tier 1 tickets, then say that. It's not difficult and everyone knows where they stand.

If it was known there only 500 Tier 1 tickets, you'd have potentially 501-20,000 cheesed off punters, disgruntled that they were sat in front of the PC ten minutes before countdown, ready to play fastest fingers and lost out.
Which would still be the case if it wasn't known.
If it was known, then there would be complaints along the likes of 'Why don't they have 1,000 Tier 1 tickets ?'' Why don't they get a computer system that can cope with demand ?'
The guys have been doing this for a long time, and I'm sure they have reasons for the choices they make. There aren't that many fests where the band are a cottage industry, putting on their own event, having to balance all sorts of issues, regarding punters, artists, legal regulations, vendors and themselves making a living.
Look at the queues to get on site and the chair dash Olympics to grab a bit of field, the weekend in that field has slowly turned from a band and audience as a big family chill out vibe, to a bit of a 'me first, rushy pushy, stress fest'.
A bit.
In my humble.

And thereby, it might be argued, perfectly reflecting the times in which it exists.  As, it certainly feels to me, is the preposterous situation of someone blaming anybody but themselves for something that was entirely a result of their own shortcomings.  

Full lineup due to be announced in half an hour...!

Tony Christie, Ben Savage & Hannah Sanders, the Zac Schulze Gang - all added to Saturday's line-up, plus "our Special Surprise Guest who will take the stage on Saturday evening immediately before Fairport Convention’s marathon closing set. Who can it be?"

When is a complete festival lineup not a complete festival lineup...when there's a special surprise guest on the poster!  I wonder if Yusuf (or whoever it is) will spill the beans this time?  

Saving Grace would be my not very original guess...

ps didn't Tony C have a dementia diagnosis a while back, or did I imagine that?  Impressive to see him still treading the boards if so.

Tony Christie is actually on Thursday.  

I can think of a few people I'd like the Special Surprise Guest to be, so it probably won't be any of them!

Whoops, silly me!

Same here, Will.  I assume "guest" implies a solo appearance...

It usually is, so they can get the stage set up for Fairport earlier and just have to move a mic or two.  I wonder if it might be a comedian, like they had some years back?  I forget exactly who it was though!

I dont think that this announcement will affect my decision.

Tony Christie did an album (The Great Irish Songbook) with Ranagri, who are playing on Saturday, so I wonder whether they came together as a package?

My whelm level is extremely low.

Jasper Carrot in 2013?

Glenn Campbell toured for several years after hisdementia diagnosis.

That's the badger!

Tony Christie…. Well at least we’ll get songs not Grammys 😁

Hmmm…Think I’ll give Thursday a skip this year and rock up for Friday/Saturday..

I can't help thinking if the Special Surprise Guest is really special, they'd surely announce a name to maybe sell more tickets?

And if it's Richard or Ralph that's hardly a surprise
It does seem a bizarre sales strategy...

Guessing Gerry Conway.

On second thought, he falls under the umbrella of "and friends." But so would RT I would think.

From the billing on the poster, I guess everyone surmises the "Special Surprise Guest" will do his/her/their own set?

Not like you Bill.

Presumably announcing a "Special Surprise Guest"  gives leeway for contract negotiations and, indeed, the possibility that the SSG's identity may change.


My Guess? Steve Knightley.

It'll be Percy surely.

He's been on so many times he can't qualify as a special guest, he's like a cousin in residence.

Roy Wood hasn't made an appearance for a few years.

My money is on Martin Carthy as "Special Surprise Guest". They don't come more special than this particular legend.

James Taylor would fit.

Bet it's Toyah again

I thought it may be Roger Daltrey the way they put ‘Who can it be?’.

Then I remembered the word ‘who’ can be used for people other than members of The Who.

Percy would be lovely...I expect people would love to see him-but I also wondered, could it just be an extra appearance from the Maestro, RT?

Forgive my ignorance, but who is this mystical Percy?

Plant, Robert Plant.

Oh right, thanks. That makes sense, surprised i didn't work it out.   :-[

As long as he has someone with him onstage to help him stay on track. He's a lovely chap.

It would be a unique situation in the 4.5 decades long history of Cropredy if it was...I'm fairly certain I'm right in saying he's never just "turned up" without being billed.  I'm fairly certain that his appearance adds guaranteed bums on seats as well, so there would appear to be little logic in the approach?

If it is someone big, then the reason for not naming them may be that they will only get a short (half-hour?) slot (plus maybe a couple of songs with Fairport), but they don't want people turning up expecting a full set from, say, Mr Plant, and then complaining that they didn't get their money's worth.  Just a thought.

Candidates:  Plant, Yusuf, Winwood, Wood, Anderson.  Any others?  Hodgson again maybe...all again, actually although Winwood has never guested.

Can't really see the James Taylor but we know how much Peggy at least has wanted that one...

Winwood was there in 2009....(I remember because a small child was lifted up onto the parent’s shoulder in front of me and I was gutted as I could not see properly). ::)

Some interesting guesses here, but come on, this is Cropredy.

It'll be Anna Ryder or someone who used to be in Tiny Tin Lady. Outside chance of one or more Pierce brother.

Oh blimey I hope not a Tiny Tin!

Cropredy village resident Joe Brown?

Frank Skinner?

Kat Gilmore remains briliant!! But not as a special guest.

Great idea!

Aye, I saw that.  Never guested though is what I meant (with FC).

I've been thinking about this a bit. There used to be a surprise, un-billed guest every year.
Then in 93 there was Planty AND Roy Wood, doing about half an hour or so each, resulting in complaints that there was less time for FC, so in 1994, there was no guest.
However, when they played Adieu, Adieu, they said 'we nicked the intro for this next one from The 'Oo', and did little snippets of Substitute, My Generation and a big chunk of Won't Get Fooled Again, with Maart singing, which rocked and the crowd went nuts.
Then we got Happy Jack and Adieu Adieu...

Maybe we might get Daltry AND Townsend - Pete was mates with Sandy.

Maybe not both - it say guest singular - but it could be Pete.

I'd err with the side that it would be Roge, if either?

I realised  afterwards but it was too late to amend the error of my ways  ;D

Plant or RT probably…
But since Tony Christie has joined the line up, possibly Peters  and Lee ( one for our younger readers!) or Bucks Fizz.
Saw Tony Christie at NFFF with Ranagri , who I have since seen on their own a few times and they’re a good band but with Christie they make Irish music a bit polite imho.
https://youtu.be/sijuJUxJoVM?si=vuwZK1mmDfVM7GY1

Lennie Peters died in 1992, so I’m afraid that won’t be possible.  :'(

Yes I know 😇😇😇🤣🤣

There are always holograms these days.  :)

Roger Daltrey is my best guess, anyway.

Serious reply!
As has been said , the act before Fairports is usually a solo act ,whilst  stage is set.
I remember not looking forward to Dennis Loccorie , forgive the spelling, then he absolutely owned the spot much to my surprise and enjoyment.I expected  Sylvia’s Mother…..got so much more.
At the risk of being contentious again it seems that some fests , including NFFF , THE costas and the river boat cruises are picking from a well run rota of acts. Doesn’t mean they’re not good cos they are , RT  SoH, Lakeman, etc etc and I guess its about what you go to a festival for.
Someone commented on my Between the Trees Fest that they don’t know most of the acts.
I have been around a long time , I have seen many of my fave bands many times. Doesn’t mean I don’t still like them and appreciate them.
Cropredy , May not be the place to introduce new faces any more, though I ve seen it done.
The days of Fairports 4 hr long headlining sets are gone, for completely understandable reasons.
So I guess the surprise guest may feature later in Fairports set .
There are some cracking bands and artists out there …..and venues…we have to use em or lose em.
As someone who plays music in the Johnsons Paint Division just getting out and playing again/still is a joy.
Hope to bump into old faces somewhere down the road this yr.

I'm just not mad about the overall concept of turning up and paying money for a lottery and a hope that something will ge really good

We re all different Stephen.There were a lot of bands I didn’t know at Magpies Fest last yr but some I did, Honey and the Bear, Chris Difford and Edward 11nd , so I checked my bets.
Same at Between the trees this yr. A few I know , a lot I don’t. You pays yer money…..

That set on Dennis' second visit was just superb. About ten minutes in he seemed to click with the crowd and it just took off. There are few Cropredy sets I have enjoyed more.

Lots of chat about Daltrey BUT if you can get him why not Friday headliner?

DW

Wendy's suggestion is Susy Quattro as she's appearing at Wickham the previous week.

You mean Leather Tuscadero from "Happy Days?" (When I was a kid, I was somewhat confused by her anachronistic appearance, dressed and coiffed like a '70s punk rocker surrounded by sock hoppers at the soda shop.)

Just seen.Billy Bragg is at Towersey so ...

Good call

Why have I only just realised that Thursday and Friday heads are both former members of Yes.

First Cropredy we will miss for 35 years and local heroes Headsticks are on at The Fringe!! Oh well perhaps from there to the main stage, or are they a bit too political?

Definitely. It's been a while since Pete did any solo stuff, I think.

I've said before that my daughter and I saw Roger's solo show in 2022, and it was breathtakingly good. We then saw The Who (5th time for me) in July, and though they were as brilliant as ever, Roger seemed utterly knackered by the end of the show (we have to remember he'll be 80 in a few weeks' time). He has started making quite a few noises lately about his nearing the end of performing. That said, The Who are playing two Teenage Cancer Trust shows at the Albert Hall this year, so you never know. But if Roger were playing Cropredy, it would make much more sense to have him headlining Friday, and to be announced to act as a draw. In addition, he has a healthy sense of his own status, and I suspect he wouldn't do anything where he wasn't headlining.

I'm not sure that the point of the guest is to be a draw, but a treat for those who are there.

The usual thing is a solo artist before Fairport to avoid a change over of instruments and amps as so on.
Daltrey would require a band, unless he's ever done an acoustic set with him playing a geetar, or maybe another guitarist.

I'm thinking it will be more along the lines of Jasper Carrot's surprise set a few years ago..maybe Bill Bailey or someone similar.

Bill Bailey would be great.

Apparently, according to an FC member a few years ago, he has been approached, and is keen, but schedules need to be aligned.

Exactly my thoughts. All those hoping for a big name band or singer who will do a full set are going to be disappointed.  It'll only be a 20-30 min thing, maybe with a couple of fairporters joining them for one or two numbers.

or could they have been waiting for Oysterband's announcement before making their own?

What are the chances of it being Roger Hodgson? I'd love that!! It's
 been a while since he last played Cropredy...
2000 was it?

It would be lovely to see him again. However he is 73 and hasn't toured since 2019 as far as I know.

But I've by no means kept up with him in the past few years so... who knows?

I think I've got it! Bryn Terfel has just released an album of folk songs. Maybe it'll be him doing a little spot?

By (Tony) Christ(ie) I think you've got it....

At least it won't be Lulu, who has just announced her retirement in April.

i see Steve Marriott's daughter Mollie is going to be backing singer on Wakemans Return of the Caped Crusader tour replacing Hayley Sanderson who has had to drop out.

Marty Wilde is releasing a new Album in May and going on a farewell tour at the age of 85. Perhaps................

Don't encourage them ::) ;D

I believe Hayley has played Croppers in the past ..

Show of Hands?

I see Fairground Attraction are reforming for a tour shortly after Eddi Reader’s appearance at Cropredy.
I wonder if this means we could actually be getting Fairground Attraction.

I'd be amazed if it was...do you really think "the three blokes in Fairground Attraction" warrant that much attention?  Bit harsh maybe but...

A valid point, to be honest I wouldn’t know the difference!

Unlikely, given that Abbotsbury in July is being heralded as their proper final appearance before their indefinite break.

If it was anybody big ( Plant , even RT etc) they would have announced it to enhance ticket sales . No it will probably be some extended member of the Fairport family……Ashley Hutchings ? Etc

I'm fairly certain I'm right in saying RT has never not been properly announced.  There's always a first time though.  Can't think he'd add many on to audience though?

Surely the idea of not doing the big reveal in advance is that folk might take a punt on it being Thompy, or Ian Anderson, or James Taylor, or David Essex?

However if the idea was to increase ticket sales ,Simons appeal would tend to imply that hasn’t worked….

Sorry about so many posts but…..
Just been re looking at the Brase lineup…..
Steve Knightly playing the Brase on Friday . Pos special guest on the Sat?
Or even While and Matthews who are playing Brase on Thurs. Chris singing Sandy again ?

All three have played the festival before; I wonder if the Brasenose is now direct competition to Cropredy? That can’t help…

Adam, I think the Brase is a fest in itself. Seperate ticketing.cracking line up.
It will be interesting to see how village parking copes with ,effectively 2 fests.

That’s my point (I think!) - I wonder how many people are going to the Brasenose/field 8 and not bothering with Cropredy tickets as they offer similar music at a cheaper price? Even if it is a hundred or so, it will still hurt.

One month to go.

No announcement of the "special guest".

There isn't one is there?

I hear the calls that "its contractual" - but at this late stage what benefit is there to be had for not announcing ? People will have August weekends pretty much planned now. Its a bit late to announce somebody < 4 weeks to go and expect ticket sales to pick up as a result. And I really cant see many even ardent fans of Guest X coughing £85 to see them - unless its swifty or the boss I suppose in which case that's cheap.

weird AF.

OMG - has anyone seen the announcement about the special guests on the Fairport web page.... :o

Probably just keeping it as a genuine surprise til the last moment….that has often happened before but without the pre-announcement of the guest. Ha ha love it Yorkshire Chris!

Wonder if there is any connection to the saturday
Brasenose afternoon slot - still not announced.
A long set at the Brase before the mainstage for a bit?

Trevor Horn has pulled out for health reasons, RT replaces him...

BUT BUT BUT...  we were told in this thread RT was in the USA and so could not possibly be the special guest (sat)  as a result.

yet here he is headlining Friday.

Whilst also being in the USA.

Oh...

Solo, not solo  ;D

Conspiracy theory alert…..which may mean he was always going to be Saturdays special guest……

Feel For Mr Horn but ...

Omnishambles is a neologism first used in the BBC political satire The Thick of It in 2009. The word is compounded from the Latin prefix omni-, meaning "all", and the word shambles, a term for a situation of total disorder. Originally a "shambles" denoted the designated stock-felling and butchery zone of a medieval street market, from the butchers' benches (Latin scamillus "low stool, a little bench"). The word refers to a situation that is seen as shambolic from all possible perspectives. It gained popularity in 2012 after sustained usage in the political sphere led to its being named Oxford English Dictionary Word of the Year, and it was formally added to the online editions of the Oxford Dictionary of English in August 2013.[2]

springs to mind.

Indeed.  Though the festival poster says "Special SURPRISE Guest".  And while RT would always be special...  he'd hardly be a "SURPRISE" would he ?

except that he is in the USA apparently then and cant possibly be at Cropredy.

Oh.

As has been said many times in here, he's never actually been a surprise unannounced guest at Cropredy, so actually it would be a surprise (of sorts).

I just think this is a last minute ' mate can you do us a favour' job.

I suspect you're correct on this.

TBF I don't think this is entirely unusual in the world of ageing musicians.  I had tickets to see the Eagles & Steely Dan in June (that cost me very deep in the purse!).  Steely Dan withdrew due to illness and were promptly replaced by the Doobie Brothers.  I would rather have seen the Dan but the Doobies were an able replacement.

I did see Richard T on his recent tour (full band) and he was on good form.

Obviously, it's sad for Trevor Horn being unable to play & we all wish him well.

However, RT is a very welcome replacement. If only there were some decent muscians on hand to form a scratch band to help him out.

My thoughts too, but they seemed very keen to stress the solo-ness (with the missus) of the performance...

I predict they'll morph into the Hand of Kindness Band at some point.

Big plug for the festival on Kermode and Mayo's Take today.

I know they are billed as The Trevor Horn Band but........ surely the band could still rip through their repertoire with a competent stand-in bass player? I know people who bought tickets looking forward to this Friday headliner will be disappointed with the replacement. Not me, I'm really chuffed that RT is performing.

From RT on Facebook (for those who don’t use it):

“I'm playing basically acoustic at Cropredy on August 9th (with some help from Zara) but we will be joined by a few chums for an electric 'segment'!”

Probably yes, but the key to the whole show is Trevor Horn's anecdotes about the different people/albums he was involved in, before they play the different songs, so it really wouldn't be the same thing.

And if one wants to know how and why Cropredy has ceased to be what it once was, then this sentence explains that more than adequately.  Sad times...

The only way of comparing which line ups have had universal appeal or not is by comparing the attendances each year.

Despite different people’s individual opinions regards acts and line ups it is still a fact that the customer is always right and they vote by their feet.

If the bigger crowds were in attendance for the likes of Alice cooper or madness as opposed to other years then that is a fact that cannot be denied.

The be all and end all is the cash generated each year.

Perhaps a look at the last twenty years attendances could shed light on what the paying customer is more likely to attend.

My personal opinion of the last 17 festivals would be that the Alice cooper year had the biggest attendance but I may be wrong.

That is slightly missing the point that Cropredy used to be a smaller festival which did not require that level of footfall to survive. As such it had a very specific identity.

I understand that the economics of festivals have changed, the reasons for that and how it have unavoidably impacted Cropredy but that has also irreversibly changed its character. For every individual who might look forward to Trevor Horn or Alice Cooper or whoever else the Friday headliner might be in the festival's 21st century iteration, there is another mourning what has been lost and for whom Cropredy no longer holds the appeal that it once did.

David's observation remains true that the sentence he quotes encapsulates all of the above, the loss of identity, the changing audience and the commercial realities that have brought it all about.

I'll just add this:  My recollection is that 1987 was the first 20k (give or take) attendance.  So it could definitely still attract the crowds without Alice Cooper and Trevor Horn...

I do genuinely hesitate to post here.
There is a lot I could say but a lot of its being said and things ain’t going to change.The  festival has changed . Fairports have changed.
But let’s revel in Nostalgia for a bit…..
My early Cropredies , irregular in the  80’s and then regularly in a convoy with friends from 95, were about Fairports. Saturday night was the high point , the focus of the fest. A 2 day fest.
3 day fest changed things.
Peggy and Christine getting divorced changed things. Security changed. H and S changed , no longer a small (ish) folk rock driven , vaguely alternative fest.
I understand the economics.
Chris replaced Maart and Metal Matty became a more twee experience….
So people started going for the Thurs night headliner and though it’s a generalisation a large portion of the field had little interest in the Saturday night headliner.
I watched some great Fairport headline sets , with guests including Vikki Clayton , Chris While, Jerry Donahue, Robert Plant , Swarb etc etc. but those days are gone.
They were wonderful times with friends ……..
Things change.
The Brasenose Fringe lineup looks like an old Cropredy line up. Old faces, new faces but with some real quality in there.
Steve Knightlys new band, the wonderful Jon Palmer Acoustic Band ( if you want folk rock…..) Tukay and Ryan, While and Matthews .
I would go but I have no idea where you would park for the day.
Any way I write this as I am about to leave for Warwick fest , to say goodbye to Oysterband and discover new stuff.
Enjoy Cropredy everybody …..and good to see Peggy,Simon and  DM will be playing with RT ….for those people on the field who know and care, who RT is……that could be special but I understand others would rather be watching the Buggles greatest hits

I like that approach and agree, but for the comparisons to be meaningful you'd also have to facter in such areas as

* when the tickets actually got bought - first release, a week before the festival, etc etc
* weather forecasts
* other events happening at the same time, or even year ie alternative attractions/spending focusses eg olympics, world cups, brit doing well in wimbledon, royal occassions etc etc
* possibility of seeing Act X on a tour elsewhere
* etc etc etc


didds (B.Sc. (Hons) Comp. Sci & Statistics)

I'll throw another iron in the fire or whatever the metaphor should be...

There are I perceive far more smaller, "local" festivals these days as well, that are far cheaper than large festivals (and at 20K we would have to accept that Cropredy is a "large" festival"). Its not beyond the wit of man to see that attending one "large" festival financially equates to 2 or 3 smaller festivals.

CF Two people+camper van
Bearded Theory : £544 (3rd ticket release, first two were sold out before I even breathed!)
Cropredy : £386

Here For The Music : £171
My Dad's Bigger Than Your Dad (1-day + transport return which represents ~40% of that cost!) : £74
Trowbridge :  £220
Tangled Roots/Tangled Up in Blues/Somerset Jazz : £150

Those smaller festivals may not see as "large" acts (and not FC obvs :-) but the quality of music is high - and H4TM this year had Black Water County (Cropredy 2024), Skinny Lister (BT 2023), Trowbridge 2023 had Holy Moly and the Crackers (Cropredy 2022 ), Gigspanner (Cropredy 2017), Merry Hell (2023), Three Daft Monkeys (Cropredy 2008) - Gaz Brookfield has played the top three smaller festivals listed and he is in the same ballpark as Beans on Toast (Cropredy 2023) in terms of following and style etc (not so much swearing ;-) ) so the stretch isn't really that great at all.


TL;DR - festival attendance costs go further at smaller festivals without necessarily losing the standard of music. And if one is in the "its about the music and vibe and not specific acts" then they all fit the bill.

Oh - ale at H4TM was £4 a pint, brewed on site!


didds

I think we should get away from thinking about Cropredy in the past as a 'small' festival.  In '79-'86 it was (I think) for 8-15k attendees and ever since it has been 20k (or as close as it can get to it).  So it was never a boutique thing.  But what was different (imho) was a firm rationale and coherence.  It was focussed on Fairport, their offshoots and (effectively) their mates.  I doubt anybody went to my first festival in 1984 that wasn't a massive Fairport fan.  That coherence was probably (to some extent) being lost already, but it was absolutely lost with the divorce and the organisational changes for the festival that followed.

And I think that's a very very well made post.

8K isn't "small" - because if it is then BT at 10k is also "small" with four stages, dance tents/areas etc etc.  Or if it is "small" then what are the likes of the other festivals i listed which are < 1K ...  "microscopic" ?  :-)

You are wrong, I'm afraid. At least one of the anniversary years was sold out.

In fairness I do remember that being a decent crowd , let’s hope this years festival is well attended but I stand by my conviction that as people age the headliners have to be relevant to a younger audience.
I’m 52 and I can’t remember Rick wakeman.
He’s not really my cup of tea but I respect his musicianship.
It’s also worth mentioning to non fairport fans that this year the other two headline acts will in essence be the same personal performing different songs over two different nights which isn’t ideal (and I really enjoy RT and FC)
If you were looking forward to headline acts that were different genres so to speak then you are out of luck.
I think that is the point others have been making and imo with justification

Not everyone is drawn to the festival because of FC these days however hard it is for others to accept and a two headline act fairport year will not be to their taste.
Nowadays the festival needs to adapt to encourage footfall , the guaranteed footfall of the past is no more due to the aging process,.
The festival will adapt and thrive I’ve no doubt and im sure there are many elederly people who only go to the wintour now to get their yearly FC fix.

I’m looking forward to the festival and I’m only trying to add balance for those that are unable to accept that time moves on.

I don't think anybody is unable to accept that time moves on.
Many have accepted already, and no longer attend, because it's different, or we are.
None of us want it to disappear completely, if only because it fuels the band for another year.
I was in my mid twenties when I started going, I'm now near enough 'elderly' - seven years older than you - don't blink, you'll be one of us soon enough  :) - those five year anniversaries seem to come every other year, now.
A couple of us have almost kicked the bucket there, including me. That year, I saw the first three acts on Thursday then retreated to the tent.
Luckily, nobody had to investigate the single tent left in field 4 on Sunday.
I think we don't really want to say goodbye to one of the loves of our lives just yet.  

I'd love to hear how.  It's a half and half thing now - it's neither wholly a Fairport Reunion for Fairport fans OR a highly desirable non attached festival in its own right. constrained as it is by it's one stage set up (and other relics from its past).  As a result, I'd contend, nobody is fully satisfied...  In the current marketplace I'm unconvinced.

"LIKE"

I have been following this thread, despite having only attended Cropredy once. A lot of good points were made, but there truly is no resolution for both the band and fans of the festival either currently or historically.  Fwiw, these are a few random points of my own because what I see is a festival that has always been unique, and unique just no longer seems to cut it in 2024 sadly.

Recently I watched a video someone copied for me of a mini-documentary of the 1996 Cropredy (forget what it was called). I also forget what amount Peggy mentioned as the fuel costs required for the festival...but it was staggering in 1996, and one can only imagine what they are now. Along with all the usual festival logistics. Bearing that in mind, the budget for booking acts is surely derived from how much is needed to cover everything else at the festival, and to cover things such as fuel spikes. And when you think about everything that is needed for a festival, even a one-stage event, I'm sure we would all faint at how much is actually required  no doubt fret about every little thing.

As to booking those acts, the thought came to me that for any festival, Cropredy included, it is rather like an established band making a set list. Think about that-

Too many new songs- 'play the classics!'
Too many old songs-' its all old folks music!'
 Too much experimentation-'what is this, a jazz festival?'
 Too much of one style of music-'not enough variety!'.

 Replace the word songs with bands/acts and you see the problem for any festival organizer, Fairport included. I have been to niche festivals before-be it blues, bluegrass, Irish music. I went to them all with a level of excitement initially and then about halfway through them all was wishing there was something different to hear. The Fairport-centric festival is indeed the origins of Cropredy but obviously the switch happened both organically (FC members and friends passing away) and out of necessity to compete with the plethora of festivals out there.

We can all play the woulda/coulda/shoulda game about what Fairport should have done 10/20/30 years ago as the festival grew. We could all play the game of what Fairport could or should do now. If I were budgeting for any festival this year I would have to make hard decisions about economics first, music second. Which is what I think all organizers are left with in what and how they present a festival to the public. And from where I stand, that is a complete change for everyone-organizers and punters alike.  Gone are the days of roughing it. Gone are the days of a tarpaulin covering a stage in the rain. Gone are the days of a chipper van being the only food on site. Now a festival has to have video screens, charging stations, social media worthy moments, and food bordering on cuisine.

So what I think IMHO is that none of this is a reflection on Fairport or festival organizers in general. It is what we as a society have become. I recently told a friend that a problem I have with things here in NY now in general is nothing can ever just be a 'thing'. It has to be a 'special thing'. A park can't just be a place with benches, grass and trees anymore, it instead has to have an event space, have its own social media site, and amenities no one ever dreamed of before. This is effectively what we as humans have become. To me it isn't just about the dollar signs and is instead about what we 'think' our needs are, and what expectations should be. It is harder to enjoy for the sake of enjoyment. Not impossible, but harder.

***Breaks into spontaneous applause***

It certainly can't keep on being all things to all people.

But it could a) return to what it was (an annual Reunion), but at a much reduced size to reflect the reduced stature of the band and of its audience.; or b) it could break the link with Fairport and become 'just another festival'

a) could work.  I'm not convinced by b).

A lot of people I work with, the majority a good twenty years younger ,who go to the big boy festivals like Glasto or Latitude etc have actually said they like the sound of the single stage set up.

Who is left for a reunion now of former members? Ian, Richard, Ashley, Dan maybe you could include Cathy le Surf ... anyone else still able to perform?

Sadly the days of wheeling out four or five different lineups is long gone hence the Saturday set being a rehash of the winter set with a couple of additions.

If you're going enjoy but not for me this year.

DW

This is one of the most sobering thoughts ever - Fairport Annual Reunion. With whom ?

Apart from Full House with Chris Leslie, or Iain and Ashley joining the band for a few numbers, the number of available significant members for any sort of reunion has seriously diminished.

By "significant" I mean members who are still alive and actually appeared on an album - so people like Shaun Frater, Paul Warren, Bob Brady, and Tom Farnell don't really count.

Everyone else is either no longer with us, or like Jerry Donahue, sadly out of action...

So the Saturday night FC set has to be FC & Friends, really...

[PS This might need to be a topic of its own...]

I still see the festival as unique in many ways.
The atmosphere
The one stage plus fringes
The fact you can park next to your tent
The fact you can take food and alcohol onto the field.

I think the only evolution will be with the line ups.
Everyone is fretting about fairport not continuing due to the passing of time?

Why ever not?

Let’s face facts when we are watching fairport lots of fuss is made regards the band and line up…
I’ve grown to enjoy the band over the years having not known a single song on my first visit….
What we are watching in essence is a cross between a modern line up and a tribute act….
Let’s face facts the original members such as Martin and Judy have passed and Ashley isn’t a band member so we are only watching a tribute act….
Or are we??

I see it as an evolution and swarb , Sandy and Gerry have played and passed and left very big footprints.
Were fairport still fairport?
I think so.

Today’s line up is it fairport?
I think so.

It’s more a case of fairport evolution than fairport convention nowadays (fairport evolution , good name for an album)

It’s inevitable at some point that just like everyone else the present band members will pass and be replaced.

I see no reason at all why fairport convention won’t be headlining the festival in 20,30,50 years time.
Imo that would be a massive selling point , the continuation through the links to the past via the music being played as it has been for decades before.
No other festival could say that..,,

The festival needs
1) FC in whatever current guise headlining
2) other headliners being more relevant to a younger audience (not 20 yo but  forty plus as opposed to sixty plus)
3) nothing else changing at all.

This festival has the chance to leave a legacy for the future as well as the past and THAT is what we should all agree makes it even more special.
The chance that after every single person on the field on Saturday has passed the festival should always remain.
Meet on the ledge ALWAYS being sung.
There’s really no reason it shouldn’t in the grand scheme.

Get more fresh blood introduced to the music of fairport and carry the baton.
Just make sure the line up entices fresh blood to attend and have an introduction into what the legacy is.

Look forward to seeing everyone on the field.

If 'the festival' is a small day long bash for, what, 1-3k people, I could just about agree.  Otherwise this is clearly wishful thinking...just look at the move to smaller venues, to Fairport being an acoustic (or 4 piece anyway) band (for 10 months of the year) and (look around you!) to the ever increasing age of Fairport audiences (along with the band members).  Fairport are 'niche' - they always have been, they always will be.  It's a lovely niche but a lot more people are checking out than are checking in...that is surely just a reality of the situation isn't it?  The highpoint of their audience I'd guess as late 80s/early 90s....?  If so, there's been about 3 decades of gentle decline.... And yes, this is outside of the festival, but this is the potential audience for the festival (if they're going for Fairport at least) isn't it?

Great to read such a POSITIVE POST!

The people who come on here and cast visions of doom and knock the Festival seem to have on e big thing in common.

They don't attend, or haven't for years .

Instead of predicting its end why not let those of us who love it just enjoy .

Absolutely nobody here is knocking the festival - some of the absolute best times of my life have been in and around that field.  Remember that Simon started this debate about the future of the festival in the current climate.  Maybe take it up with him...  ;)

What David said. I'm not knocking the festival either - I haven't been for a few years but having attended 14 times over the years, obviously I wouldn't have gone so many times if I didn't love it.

I actually hold Cropredy up as a prime example of how to run a festival properly - it's always been a thoroughly fun and civilised weekend in the country.

It's just that, as I've stated in previous posts, the serious increase in the price of goods and services (and personal health issues) has made going to festivals less essential for me than it used to be.

Another POSITIVE post, thank you.

I totally agree with every word. I don’t often post on here but I am an avid reader and I think many have been negative as some have stated. To add my two penn’orth I think that everything in life changes and evolves. This is the case with the festival. It couldn’t be like it was (a reunion) because as already stated there are so few left now. Therefore by definition the festival had to change regarding who played, it physically couldn’t be the same as it was 35 years ago. What hasn’t changed to me however is the atmosphere, the friendliness and the general vibe, which to my mind is almost as important as the music. I was 29 when I first went in 1980 and apart from the 2 postponed ones I’ve been to every one. I wouldn’t miss it for the world.

I prefer to be positive regards the festivals future rather than hold a one day affair for a small crowd.
To get people who have never heard FC before to listen to them , you need bands that they are likely to want to come and hear.
I can state that from personal experience.
How many people under forty would have heard of FC if they hadn’t attended cropredy.
Very few in my opinion…
I’d say I’m not the only one who has come back for many years having experienced the whole package the festival offers.
FC were not my original reason for attending but by doing so I’ve grown to enjoy their music and the festival experience.

Get more new blood to attend by putting on a popular line up and I’m sure many others who have yet to visit would become hooked.
You have to get them through the door first in order to hope like me that they will be converted……

With the correct organisation there is no reason this cannot happen.
It’s a lesson that needs taking on board…

The average age of attendees needs lowering in order to achieve this but it’s entirely possible imo

My comment wasn’t meant to be negative at all either. More just an opinion about how difficult and costly it is to organize a festival, be it Cropredy or any other one. I was talking about festival culture in the times we are in now. Long may Cropredy continue, as well as Fairport.

What Wandering Steve said really, we have certain freedoms at Cropredy that I will always appreciate. The vibe and atmosphere is a delight to experience and I am so pleased that the village has benefited from the festival in so many ways.

By way of contrast I recently attended a Michael Kiwanuka gig at Halifax Piece Hall which is mainly an outdoor venue.  The weather forecast was for showers & rain.  However the security refused to let people in with umbrellas, also if you had your wet weather gear in a rucksack, tough - no rucksacks admitted.  These items had to be left in large dustbins at security and you were left to rummage for your possessions after the show.

Ask different people what could/should be on at Cropredy and you will of course get a lot of different answers.  Four of my mates who attended last year have declined this time.  2023 had enough old favourites to entice them - Fripp/Toyah, Strawbs, 10 CC, Chic, but nothing grabbed them this time.  Not exactly new blood or younger music but that's the stuff that will persuade them to attend.  I appreciate that 4 is a small sample but it shows what a problem the organisers have in selecting a line up to please most of us most of the time.

I'm an ever present since 1983 and four of us attend every year whatever the line up, we treat it as a summer holiday.  FWIW I thought 2002 was the weakest line up in memory, and even that wasn't bad.  Thursday lunchtime at the cricket pavilion anyone?