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Author Topic: Attendance  (Read 3199 times)
David W
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Cropredy 2018


« Reply #40 on: August 13, 2018, 08:38:10 AM »


Gub Gubs  attitude towards our festival is imho appalling. Who is going to travel 165 miles to a festival for just two days? Putting tents up, taking down etc especially with older people and mobility allowances. To make it smaller just seems ridiculous. I also agree with many people on here.. that people who do not attend the festival anyway...why are they criticising or just coming in with an opinion...they were not there. !!!




And therein lies the problem - whatever folks think it is not "our festival" it is a commercial concern which operates on that basis. For many years it was a two day festival and nobody minded travelling to attend and I am sorry but apart from basic access issues - which are dealt with pretty well as far as I know - there is no relevance to older people having to put up tents etc, simply not part of the same argument.

DW
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hendo (Dave)
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« Reply #41 on: August 13, 2018, 08:54:34 AM »

I am hesitating to write as I wasn't there this year but.....
Those of us who attended regularly know it was a two day fest, it was much smaller, it was Fairport centric.
Fairport's core audience would not fill a fest now. Tempis Fugit.
I completely understand why the fest has changed,why it had to ,  it started to happen when Peggy and Christine divorced and it stopped being a big........very big Village Green Festival.
You cannot go back 25 years Al.
I still have a 93 T shirt that proclaims the line up as
Fairport Convention
Richard and Danny Thompson
Leningrad Cowboys
Clarion
Vikki Clayton
Martin Barre Band
Stock tons Wing
Robin Williamson
The Buttermountain Boys
Fallen Angels
With Bobby Bragg and Geoff Hughes as compčres.
I don't see a line up like that pulling a huge audience these days.
The other factor is the expedential growth of small folky ( and not so folky fests) some advertised nationally, over 300 on the Folk pages this year and a lot of small local fests pulling very good line ups, Folk in a Field, Farmer Phils, Folk on the Farm, New Forest Folk Fest and I even include Folk East as examples!
So you can't go back. I voted with my feet and stopped going cos it wasn't how I remember my halcyon days of Cropredy but I am a Luddite and an old f**t.
At a small fest we were playing yesterday, WOODFEST, I picked up an album by a singer Andy Griffiths which is just beautiful.
It is these finds that make fests special for me ,,,,,,,I can think back to several ' discoveries' I made at Cropredy.
Hope you found one this year .
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Jim
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« Reply #42 on: August 13, 2018, 08:56:11 AM »


I don't get the people thinking that last years line was better than this years. Come on, Brian Wilson compared to Devine Comedy !!!!!!!!!!! I've read all the comments about Brian, BUT, he is a legend and would sell out lots of big venues worldwide, Divine Comedy wouldn't sell out my local theartre.
I know it was Fairports 50th last year and the Fairport related line up was very good with RT ect but the rest of the line up was poor, in my opinion, compared to this year.





You didnt love the DIVINE Comedy?
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« Reply #43 on: August 13, 2018, 08:57:48 AM »


I was under the impression that the "Thursday Headline Act" was announced late in the day because the preferred act had backed out. Any idea if this was true and if so who was the preferred act?
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David W
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« Reply #44 on: August 13, 2018, 08:59:38 AM »



I don't get the people thinking that last years line was better than this years. Come on, Brian Wilson compared to Devine Comedy !!!!!!!!!!! I've read all the comments about Brian, BUT, he is a legend and would sell out lots of big venues worldwide, Divine Comedy wouldn't sell out my local theartre.
I know it was Fairports 50th last year and the Fairport related line up was very good with RT ect but the rest of the line up was poor, in my opinion, compared to this year.



You didnt love the DIVINE Comedy?
Pearls before swine.😢


Who did a pretty good job of selling out the O2 Institute in Birmingham when I saw then in November.

DW
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barryanorak (Julian)
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« Reply #45 on: August 13, 2018, 10:16:11 AM »

Attendance was noticeably down, there was a lot more room on the field - how much of an impact has the 'Fringe' had on the numbers - it does seem to have taken on a life of its own in the last few years...
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« Reply #46 on: August 13, 2018, 10:42:59 AM »




I don't get the people thinking that last years line was better than this years. Come on, Brian Wilson compared to Devine Comedy !!!!!!!!!!! I've read all the comments about Brian, BUT, he is a legend and would sell out lots of big venues worldwide, Divine Comedy wouldn't sell out my local theartre.
I know it was Fairports 50th last year and the Fairport related line up was very good with RT ect but the rest of the line up was poor, in my opinion, compared to this year.



You didnt love the DIVINE Comedy?
Pearls before swine.😢


Who did a pretty good job of selling out the O2 Institute in Birmingham when I saw then in November.

DW

But, with respect, that's a 2000 capacity venue and you think they did well to sell it out.
Some people I know always ask "who is on " when I mention I'm going to Cropredy and last year, when I said Divine Comedy more than one person came back with "never heard of them"
  Everyone has different tastes and if you like DC fair play, the point I made is that they are not an "Headline" band.
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David W
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« Reply #47 on: August 13, 2018, 10:54:50 AM »



But, with respect, that's a 2000 capacity venue and you think they did well to sell it out.
Some people I know always ask "who is on " when I mention I'm going to Cropredy and last year, when I said Divine Comedy more than one person came back with "never heard of them"
  Everyone has different tastes and if you like DC fair play, the point I made is that they are not an "Headline" band.


If a band is selling out mid size venues - 2000 ish - I would argue that makes them a perfect for for a Cropredy headline, Alice and Madness aside the Thursday headliners have been right in that ballpark:

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Penguin (Dunc)
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« Reply #48 on: August 13, 2018, 11:45:53 AM »


Gub Gubs  attitude towards our festival is imho appalling. Who is going to travel 165 miles to a festival for just two days? Putting tents up, taking down etc especially with older people and mobility allowances. To make it smaller just seems ridiculous. I also agree with many people on here.. that people who do not attend the festival anyway...why are they criticising or just coming in with an opinion...they were not there. !!!


Did this for the first 7 years I went to Cropredy until it became a three day even in 2000.

Still actually do this for the wonderful 2-day Moonbeams Festival in July, but it's only a hundred mile round trip though!  Smiley
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GubGub (Al)
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« Reply #49 on: August 13, 2018, 01:04:31 PM »


Gub Gubs  attitude towards our festival is imho appalling. Who is going to travel 165 miles to a festival for just two days? Putting tents up, taking down etc especially with older people and mobility allowances. To make it smaller just seems ridiculous. I also agree with many people on here.. that people who do not attend the festival anyway...why are they criticising or just coming in with an opinion...they were not there. !!!




Apalling? Really?  Roll Eyes

Anyway, the answer to your question is, historically, plenty of people. Cropredy was a two day festival for many, many years and was well attended during that period.



You cannot go back 25 years Al.



I am not suggesting that at all Dave. I possibly wasn't clear but what I am proposing is that it should be a modern festival with a focussed music policy (growing out of Fairport's legacy but clearly the band themselves can be longer be the primary commercial draw), catering to a more specific demographic without having to appeal to a mass popular audience. Something like Shrewsbury may be the model or the late lamented Big Session.
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Wandering Steve
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« Reply #50 on: August 13, 2018, 02:25:04 PM »

The facts are the years that sell out are because they have top notch headline acts.
The other mix of acts and fairport of course is fine but if the headliners are poor the attendance is down.
Get the headliners right you have a sellout
Get it wrong and you don’t.
The facts are 12-15,000 will turn up come what may,even if the line up is top heavy with acoustic folk acts.
Do the job right with proper headline acts and a decent mix of music with the emphasis on folk (around 50/50) and you sell out.

At the end of the day the paying customer votes with their feet and dictates whether the festival will be a success and the customer is always right.

If the job is done properly cropredy would sell out EVERY year.
I have absolutely no doubt about that.
The customers ARE out there as has been proven it just needs getting the job done correctly.
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johnmitch93
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« Reply #51 on: August 13, 2018, 03:59:48 PM »




But, with respect, that's a 2000 capacity venue and you think they did well to sell it out.
Some people I know always ask "who is on " when I mention I'm going to Cropredy and last year, when I said Divine Comedy more than one person came back with "never heard of them"
  Everyone has different tastes and if you like DC fair play, the point I made is that they are not an "Headline" band.


If a band is selling out mid size venues - 2000 ish - I would argue that makes them a perfect for for a Cropredy headline, Alice and Madness aside the Thursday headliners have been right in that ballpark:

Alice was fantastic - a superb Thursday choice...!

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« Reply #52 on: August 13, 2018, 07:48:41 PM »

TBH I like it when it doesn't sell out. The field is easier to navigate and the campsite seems friendlier. When Alice Cooper played and it sold out the Thursday was pretty chaotic and the campsite was rammed. It was fun to see all the aging hippies and I count myself in that group, staring in wonder and bewilderment at the people dressed up as Alice complete with face paint. After Thursday they all seemed to melt away and there were a lot of empty plots on the campsite When it sells out because of a Fairport reason then you're really talking, it's a chance to see all the familiar old faces up on stage and around the field and the set list is often fantastic. Listen to What we did on our Saturday which for me is one of the best Fairport CD's for ages.
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Sue & Chris
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« Reply #53 on: August 13, 2018, 11:54:37 PM »


The facts are the years that sell out are because they have top notch headline acts.
The other mix of acts and fairport of course is fine but if the headliners are poor the attendance is down.
Get the headliners right you have a sellout
Get it wrong and you don’t.
The facts are 12-15,000 will turn up come what may,even if the line up is top heavy with acoustic folk acts.
Do the job right with proper headline acts and a decent mix of music with the emphasis on folk (around 50/50) and you sell out.

At the end of the day the paying customer votes with their feet and dictates whether the festival will be a success and the customer is always right.

If the job is done properly cropredy would sell out EVERY year.
I have absolutely no doubt about that.
The customers ARE out there as has been proven it just needs getting the job done correctly.


Sorry, but it's just not true that 'top notch headline acts' lead to sell outs. Fairport anniversary/reunion years lead to sell outs. Pretty much nothing else does. I can recall maybe one non-anniversary/reunion year that sold out, and I'm not even sure about that.

I agree that line up is important, but I don't think it's just a matter of getting a 'top' headliner (a completely subjective thing anyway) and the rest will automatically follow.
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davidmjs
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« Reply #54 on: August 14, 2018, 06:42:11 AM »



Gub Gubs  attitude towards our festival is imho appalling. Who is going to travel 165 miles to a festival for just two days? Putting tents up, taking down etc especially with older people and mobility allowances. To make it smaller just seems ridiculous. I also agree with many people on here.. that people who do not attend the festival anyway...why are they criticising or just coming in with an opinion...they were not there. !!!




Apalling? Really?  Roll Eyes

Anyway, the answer to your question is, historically, plenty of people. Cropredy was a two day festival for many, many years and was well attended during that period.



You cannot go back 25 years Al.



I am not suggesting that at all Dave. I possibly wasn't clear but what I am proposing is that it should be a modern festival with a focussed music policy (growing out of Fairport's legacy but clearly the band themselves can be longer be the primary commercial draw), catering to a more specific demographic without having to appeal to a mass popular audience. Something like Shrewsbury may be the model or the late lamented Big Session.


It can't do that because it is both physically and 'spiritually' tied to the one stage, static audience model....which really doesn't fit into the modern concept of what a festival 'is'.  I still think it should return to its original modus operandi.
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hendo (Dave)
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« Reply #55 on: August 14, 2018, 07:21:13 AM »

It is arguable that Cropredy is no longer one stage.
The rise of the fringe and particularly the very strong line up the Brasenose put on this year, effectively produces 3 stages. It is a no longer walk from the field to the fringe than it is between stages at larger fests.
Interesting to read reviews where people have said I missed so and so as I went to watch , Merry Hell, Clarion etc.
The fringe also attracts a separate audience that is not there to see Fairport's  , does not necessarily  have the same vibe as the main field, so the fringe becomes a more raucous scene affecting the village and villagers in a different way to how they have accepted the main festival over the last 40 years
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GubGub (Al)
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« Reply #56 on: August 14, 2018, 10:19:11 AM »




Gub Gubs  attitude towards our festival is imho appalling. Who is going to travel 165 miles to a festival for just two days? Putting tents up, taking down etc especially with older people and mobility allowances. To make it smaller just seems ridiculous. I also agree with many people on here.. that people who do not attend the festival anyway...why are they criticising or just coming in with an opinion...they were not there. !!!




Apalling? Really?  Roll Eyes

Anyway, the answer to your question is, historically, plenty of people. Cropredy was a two day festival for many, many years and was well attended during that period.



You cannot go back 25 years Al.



I am not suggesting that at all Dave. I possibly wasn't clear but what I am proposing is that it should be a modern festival with a focussed music policy (growing out of Fairport's legacy but clearly the band themselves can be longer be the primary commercial draw), catering to a more specific demographic without having to appeal to a mass popular audience. Something like Shrewsbury may be the model or the late lamented Big Session.


It can't do that because it is both physically and 'spiritually' tied to the one stage, static audience model....which really doesn't fit into the modern concept of what a festival 'is'.  I still think it should return to its original modus operandi.


I think the principle could still be applied to a single stage set up. Just a smaller stage/arena.
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Wandering Steve
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« Reply #57 on: August 14, 2018, 12:44:52 PM »



The facts are the years that sell out are because they have top notch headline acts.
The other mix of acts and fairport of course is fine but if the headliners are poor the attendance is down.
Get the headliners right you have a sellout
Get it wrong and you don’t.
The facts are 12-15,000 will turn up come what may,even if the line up is top heavy with acoustic folk acts.
Do the job right with proper headline acts and a decent mix of music with the emphasis on folk (around 50/50) and you sell out.

At the end of the day the paying customer votes with their feet and dictates whether the festival will be a success and the customer is always right.

If the job is done properly cropredy would sell out EVERY year.
I have absolutely no doubt about that.
The customers ARE out there as has been proven it just needs getting the job done correctly.


Sorry, but it's just not true that 'top notch headline acts' lead to sell outs. Fairport anniversary/reunion years lead to sell outs. Pretty much nothing else does. I can recall maybe one non-anniversary/reunion year that sold out, and I'm not even sure about that.

I agree that line up is important, but I don't think it's just a matter of getting a 'top' headliner (a completely subjective thing anyway) and the rest will automatically follow.

I was under the impression the Alice cooper year and madness year were sell outs,or close too.
One things for sure they certainly attracted more attendees than this years poor turn out.
From memory neither were fairport anniversary’s either.
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Tony Mc
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« Reply #58 on: August 14, 2018, 01:52:22 PM »

The year Jools Holland played it was packed on the Thursday but noticeably quieter Friday and Saturday, which suggest people paid in full just to see him. I hate it when the field is so packed you can't move, so quieter the better for me.
We made the disastrous decision to just do the fringes this year. What a failure. It was like licking the sweet shop window and not being allowed in (especially when we were turned away from field 8!). Having said that, I do think the festival is now becoming just another festival and moving away from the Fairport celebration it was meant to be. They compete with far more events throughout the summer than 25 years ago, certainly I don't remember so many festivals going on. If you want to win customers you need the big names, or crowd pleasers...I suggest Kaiser Chiefs, or Simple Minds would do it (for those who want Percy, he is old hat as well these days, the youngsters don't know him...Brian Wislon drew a blank with some of my younger friends)!
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« Reply #59 on: August 14, 2018, 02:37:09 PM »

All these various suggestions as to what Cropredy should or shouldn’t be and what it could or couldn’t do to change things....Can it just continue please as I believe most people still enjoy it. I know economics dictate but I don’t think it should be turned into a competition with other festivals
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